[Blackstone]

I'd be surprised if she was dead. Kelmomas is not particularly reliable, and I assume that Kellhus teleported away from the danger and took her with him. He seemed to like her more than a Dunyain should.
That whole scene was rather confusing, I'll have to read it more closely once I get the full release.

I'd agree with you, but he seems to teleport after the chunk of rock crashes to the ground.

[Wilshire]

If she is dead, Kellhus will descend further into madness I think.

[H]

His comment to her, that he came back to "salvage what he could" I immediately took to mean saving her.  Thinking about it now, I think he meant taking Meppa alive and turning Malowebi into, well, whatever the hell he is now, Ciphrang-Malowebi I guess.

[Somnambulist]

His comment to her, that he came back to "salvage what he could" I immediately took to mean saving her.  Thinking about it now, I think he meant taking Meppa alive and turning Malowebi into, well, whatever the hell he is now, Ciphrang-Malowebi I guess.

And to retrieve his little monster.

[H]

His comment to her, that he came back to "salvage what he could" I immediately took to mean saving her.  Thinking about it now, I think he meant taking Meppa alive and turning Malowebi into, well, whatever the hell he is now, Ciphrang-Malowebi I guess.

And to retrieve his little monster.

Perhaps, but we saw no evidence of that since he leave him in the Throne Room all the same...

[Somnambulist]

Did he teleport away?  I don't recall that.  I'll have to look at it again.

[Blackstone]

Did he teleport away?  I don't recall that.  I'll have to look at it again.

I think it's implied that he did, since the next scene is him in the tent with Malowebi. I believe the scene in the throne room ends with Kell sitting on his throne. I no longer have my ARC so I can't check.

[Wilshire]

Did he teleport away?  I don't recall that.  I'll have to look at it again.

I think it's implied that he did, since the next scene is him in the tent with Malowebi. I believe the scene in the throne room ends with Kell sitting on his throne. I no longer have my ARC so I can't check.

I'm not sure on the timeline of that whole thing, but there is no direct referance to him teleporting. I actually got the feeling that the Malowebi scene took place before the throne room scene. I'm kind of wondering if we were supposed to be wondering if Kellhus survived.

[H]

I'm not sure on the timeline of that whole thing, but there is no direct referance to him teleporting. I actually got the feeling that the Malowebi scene took place before the throne room scene. I'm kind of wondering if we were supposed to be wondering if Kellhus survived.

Yeah, I'm realizing I only implied that from the next scene being the Malowebi one.  Boy, that part is confusing...

[Blackstone]

Did he teleport away?  I don't recall that.  I'll have to look at it again.

I think it's implied that he did, since the next scene is him in the tent with Malowebi. I believe the scene in the throne room ends with Kell sitting on his throne. I no longer have my ARC so I can't check.

I'm not sure on the timeline of that whole thing, but there is no direct referance to him teleporting. I actually got the feeling that the Malowebi scene took place before the throne room scene. I'm kind of wondering if we were supposed to be wondering if Kellhus survived.

I think Malowebi happened after. Kell still had both Decapitants on his belt when Esmi saw him.

[Somnambulist]

Did he teleport away?  I don't recall that.  I'll have to look at it again.

I think it's implied that he did, since the next scene is him in the tent with Malowebi. I believe the scene in the throne room ends with Kell sitting on his throne. I no longer have my ARC so I can't check.

I'm not sure on the timeline of that whole thing, but there is no direct referance to him teleporting. I actually got the feeling that the Malowebi scene took place before the throne room scene. I'm kind of wondering if we were supposed to be wondering if Kellhus survived.

I think Malowebi happened after. Kell still had both Decapitants on his belt when Esmi saw him.

That's a good point.  I think that chapter bounces around.  However, I have some minor doubts.  IMO, the Decapitant would probably have had to have been attached pretty much right away, right?  I mean, you wouldn't let a body bleed out from being decapitated, then go back later and attach a demon head.  Would you?  Seems like the body would still need it's blood to function, but hell, maybe not with a demon head grafted onto it.

Also, Kellhus appears in Fanayal's camp only after the first earthquake, not after the second.  Again, why would he show up in camp, thrash everyone, teleport to the palace, yada yada, then teleport back to the camp to attach the demon head?  Unless the body needed time to exsanguinate first.  Circuitous thoughts! ah!

[Blackstone]

Did he teleport away?  I don't recall that.  I'll have to look at it again.

I think it's implied that he did, since the next scene is him in the tent with Malowebi. I believe the scene in the throne room ends with Kell sitting on his throne. I no longer have my ARC so I can't check.

I'm not sure on the timeline of that whole thing, but there is no direct referance to him teleporting. I actually got the feeling that the Malowebi scene took place before the throne room scene. I'm kind of wondering if we were supposed to be wondering if Kellhus survived.

I think Malowebi happened after. Kell still had both Decapitants on his belt when Esmi saw him.

That's a good point.  I think that chapter bounces around.  However, I have some minor doubts.  IMO, the Decapitant would probably have had to have been attached pretty much right away, right?  I mean, you wouldn't let a body bleed out from being decapitated, then go back later and attach a demon head.  Would you?  Seems like the body would still need it's blood to function, but hell, maybe not with a demon head grafted onto it.

Also, Kellhus appears in Fanayal's camp only after the first earthquake, not after the second.  Again, why would he show up in camp, thrash everyone, teleport to the palace, yada yada, then teleport back to the camp to attach the demon head?  Unless the body needed time to exsanguinate first.  Circuitous thoughts! ah!

When I did my second read, I decided that he didn't kill Malowebi immediately. It says the sword came down, but it could have been the pommel of the sword to knock him out instead of the blade to kill him. Then Kell transported to the throne room because he was short on time. Then back to make a demon. That's the only thing that makes sense to me with the way it's written right now.

[Madness]

Sorry, double post, but another thought:

I'm fairly sure Meppa is that kid in TTT that Aurang "tells a secret." Wouldn't it be really interesting, since learning that it was the Dunyain and not the Cishaurim or the Psuhke responsible for outing the Skin-Spies, that the Consult might have helped the kid learn the Psuhke so that he'd be another thorn in Kellhus' side later?

I don't think it could be the kid. Meppa seems like he is quite aged.

I'll probably comment more in profgrape's other thread but water is passion, passion is stress, stress prematurely ages, etc, etc .

So... Did we just witness Esmi's death?  She isn't mentioned after they both turn to look at Kelmomas, and a 'bastion' fell on the spot where Kellhus and she were together.  Kelmomas only loved Esmenet, and it says he was bereft of all he had loved and known.  I think Esmenet just died. 

By my flerwed reading, I suspect that Kelmomas is so upset because he thought he was supposed to help the Warrior kill Kellhus and he inadvertently stops that from happening.

Also, Bakker has said previously that Achamian and Esmenet interact again - thus, killing all such debate about their fates until they do so. I'll have to dig for that quote, though.

His comment to her, that he came back to "salvage what he could" I immediately took to mean saving her.  Thinking about it now, I think he meant taking Meppa alive and turning Malowebi into, well, whatever the hell he is now, Ciphrang-Malowebi I guess.

And to retrieve his little monster.

+1 both those, though I don't discount that "salvage what he could" includes saving Esmenet, in addition to Meppa/Ciphrang-Malowebi.

Did he teleport away?  I don't recall that.  I'll have to look at it again.

I think it's implied that he did, since the next scene is him in the tent with Malowebi. I believe the scene in the throne room ends with Kell sitting on his throne. I no longer have my ARC so I can't check.

I'm not sure on the timeline of that whole thing, but there is no direct referance to him teleporting. I actually got the feeling that the Malowebi scene took place before the throne room scene. I'm kind of wondering if we were supposed to be wondering if Kellhus survived.

I think Malowebi happened after. Kell still had both Decapitants on his belt when Esmi saw him.

That's a good point.  I think that chapter bounces around.  However, I have some minor doubts.  IMO, the Decapitant would probably have had to have been attached pretty much right away, right?  I mean, you wouldn't let a body bleed out from being decapitated, then go back later and attach a demon head.  Would you?  Seems like the body would still need it's blood to function, but hell, maybe not with a demon head grafted onto it.

Also, Kellhus appears in Fanayal's camp only after the first earthquake, not after the second.  Again, why would he show up in camp, thrash everyone, teleport to the palace, yada yada, then teleport back to the camp to attach the demon head?  Unless the body needed time to exsanguinate first.  Circuitous thoughts! ah!

When I did my second read, I decided that he didn't kill Malowebi immediately. It says the sword came down, but it could have been the pommel of the sword to knock him out instead of the blade to kill him. Then Kell transported to the throne room because he was short on time. Then back to make a demon. That's the only thing that makes sense to me with the way it's written right now.

Sadly, I think all of this is a result of writerly and oversight error .

I second HP's thought that it would be real nice if Overlook/Bakker could source this ARC discussion and amend the canon artifact accordingly.

[H]

As it's written though, I don't see where Esmenet is, except under the falling vault.  Granted, we don't see her after it's said that Kel shouts to them and Kellhus takes a step, but that is all we get, except seeing Kellhus walking alone toward the throne.  It's said the vault falls where he was, which would be where Esmenet was too, but again, it is unclear where she was at that point.

[Somnambulist]

To be clear, when I said 'retrieve his little monster' I meant Kelmomas.  As far as Kellhus is either aware or unaware of, imo, most of his children are in mortal danger or are already dead.  Kayutas is with the GO, likely to fail at Golgotterath.  Serwa is in Ishterebinth, likely to die fighting the Nonmen allied with Golgotterath.  Thelli is no use to him, really, and is dead anyway.  Inrilatas, again no practical use and dead.  Samarmas, no use, dead.  Kelmomas is, to all outward appearances, the only Anasurimbor child likely to survive current events.  Along with saving Esmi (maybe), Kelmomas had to be a reason to return.

While on the subject of Kelmomas, anyone else think this is super weird?  TGO ARC, pg. 452

Ruined! Samarmas screamed, assailed him, biting deep into his neck before vanishing into his own shadow palace, the hollow bones of the boy's own thought.  Kelmomas scrunched the collar of his tunic – the one he had donned after his altercation with Theliopa – under his jaw and chin to staunch the blood.
He liked to remind him from time to time, his twin.
Remind him what it had been like before.

So... this raises a couple of theories to me.  One, Kel (and really all Anasurimbor) suffers from some form of mental illness, some kind of MPD.  Maybe he hurt himself, and in his illness called the hurter Samarmas.

Or two, Samarmas is an actual entity within Kel that can manifest and interact with the 'real' world.

Anyone have thoughts on this?